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Jordan Peterson – IQ and The Job Market

100 Replies to “Jordan Peterson – IQ and The Job Market”

  • I must admit something for truely loving the queen of truth: Mathematicians often aren't the smartest in the university, as much I'd like to believe this. Real life is often far more complex than mathematical modells for example.

    Keen and super fast fighters, who adapt to their opponents and their movements in no time, who invent new fighting techniques on the spot, are the REALLY smart people but also those guys who invent new tools to build houses or invent new tools for plumbers to make their life better. Or star architects. This takes phenomenal imagination skills. It takes more spacial imagination to do those things, than it takes phantasy to solve most mathematical problems.

    For physics and math one must be willing to have high dedication and patience, loving the problems at hand, but we aren't the smartest.

    The machine inventers like Elon Musk, who imagine highly complex objects in their mind, who can draw like Leonardo Da Vinci technically, are the true kings of intelligence.

    You guys deserve the truth.

    P.S. Btw, IQ is that what the test producer thinks what IQ is and no test can reliably and validly meassure a genius, because a genius would tanscend most IQ test authors in their problem solving originality and an IQ-test whose producer isn't nearly as that cannot utilise the strenghts of such a phenomenal person meassurably in more than maximum the processing speed quality.

  • I think they might want to re-examine their job-IQ chart. Keep in mind that by def'n, an IQ of 100 is average for white Europeans. If memory serves, an IQ of 115 is the average IQ of a graduate student. If one goes by the Peterson's slides, one needs an IQ in the 85th percentile to be a teacher, RN or purchasing agent. I find this notion to be highly dubious. None of these jobs require above average intelligence.

  • Unfortunately, individuals with very low IQ's won't fully comprehend most of this video, and are able to apply it to their own lives to improve their situations.

  • A question for people with an higher IQ.

    Lately I'm experiencing problems regarding the capabilitys of others to think or to follow my statements and I'm not sure if the problem is that I'm slightly "more capable" than they are or something else. My IQ is not like "that high" it's around 140.
    In general it's like I have zero problem following or talking about complex topics even in fields I have no or close to non experience with and it doesn't matter if I'm slightly sick, tired or whatever. But I got the feeling like for others thinking can be hard from the get go. And I know some equaly smart people with 120IQ who are barely capable to follow me sometimes and get exhausted realy fast when talking to me. Or a friend of mine with 125-130 who last time we saw after about an hour said it get's exhausting.
    For me personally I barely know occasions in which I had problems to think or found it exhausting. Of course I think a lot but I wonder if other's don't?

    Now I would love to know if someone had similar problems with talking to people.

  • I did an armed robbery in Holland when I was 17. They let me do an IQ test so they could give me an accordingly threathment . I got 122 IQ and 129 EQ and my fellow convict 87 and 104. He got out in 3 months and had special threathment like in an hospital but slept at home and I was sentenced 2 years because It had to be me to come up with the plan and abuse his dumbness for my better. Actually he came up with it and I just followed but thats the turnside on being “smart” I guess..

  • "I won't tell you who is at the other end"

    We all know it: social "scientists" 😛

    That's why so many of them deny the significance of IQ.

  • Why an obsession over intelligence quotient if you can't do much about it anyway? Higher IQ is a general predictor of better success overall in career and other domains, but it is not a guarantee of a good or decently lived life. There are people who are highly intelligent that do end up fucking up their whole lives with substance abuse, end up unemployed, have problems finding partners, have poor social relationships, or end up depressed and suicidal. And there are many people with average or less than average intelligence that end up living amazing, wholesome lives. IQ is just one number. Just one number. Not an excuse for some zealous people to discriminate or promote stupid or dangerous ideas.

  • THEY CALL THEMSELVES EXPERTS ON EVERYTHING UNDER THE SUN; SO TELL ME HOW MUCH "QI" DOES ONE HAVE TO "LACK"
    TO MURDER INNOCENT BLACK PEOPLE, OR GROUPS OF PEOPLE PERIOD FOR THAT MATTER ???? BECAUSE EVERYONE HAS SEEN WITH THEIR OWN EYES, HOW "THEM AND THEIR RACE-SOLDIER WHITE COPS" HAVE INTENTIONALLY MURDERED UNARMED, INNOCENT BLACKS "RIGHT ON FILM", AND WE WOULD JUST LIKE TO KNOW "HOW LOW DOES YOUR IQ HAVE TO BE";
    PRETTY LOW I'D GUESS, WOULD'NT YOU SAY, EVEN HEATHEN-LIKE. LET THAT MARINATE IN YOUR BRAIN FOR A FEW MINUTES,
    "SO-CALLED "STABLE WHITE GENIUSES." !!!!

  • Ok, but I want to bring some propositions forward. IQ might be improved by up to 15% with practice. Also, what you can't improve in IQ, you can improve in knowledge. So, maybe those people with an IQ of 80, if they studied and learned some more knowledge along the way, they could solve what he was trying to teach them faster, not as fast as those with high IQ, but faster. Also, getting a good education since your a baby might improve the chances of success a lot. I also doubt IQ is only genetics, but I have to read and research more on the subject. Don't get me wrong, I like Peterson and listen to him and read his book also..but I disagree with him on this. I have to read more on the subject though.

  • ive got an IQ of 142 and the best Britain can come up with is to leave me with brain damage, physical disabilities, and a job market that pays who you know not what you know. in short an IQ wont help.

  • First ask the question how IQ and sociopathic behaviour is linked and you will find a greater insight into how the world is so fucked up, IQ can determine ability to function but does it deal with consequence of action of the individual. Most people have normal IQs most people are normal.. Intelligence is not linked with social responsibility only with results.

  • Not sure I agree. First, many jobs, probably most jobs, don't require an advanced IQ. Second, emotional IQ matters; This roughly translates as social skills.

  • Damn it Jordan tell us who is at the lowest end of the student spectrum? Gender Studies students??

  • Jordan Peterson, who are you to decide what kind of people can do what kind of jobs?, you are just a simple man like the rest of us, you just say some bullshit and think people will believe that

  • sorry Jordan, but robots are already in Maccas… at least for ordering.
    And I could see myself making robots to do the production as well.
    Would that be an *improvement*?
    Probably from Copr HQ's POV… but the customers will ultimately decide.
    Perhaps UberEats will obviate drive-thru and fast foods Bricks-and-Mortar?

  • He's probably wrong about the 10 % of people that can't do any job. The current (10/2019 Eurostat) unemployment rate in the US is 3.7 % and in some EU countries, such as the Czech republic, Germany, Poland, Hungary, it's even lower. Assuming that the statistics about 10 % of people having IQ <83 is also correct, it must be his reasoning that is flawed. Perhaps the army isn't the least picky organization, and the fact that you can't serve in the army doesn't actually mean you can't do any job.

  • This is silly, intelligence has nothing to do with how well you do with repetitive tasks, that's an entirely distinct matter.

  • Total bullshit. Jobs are first and foremost a political issue, not a matter of intelligence. You'd think smart people would never have trouble finding work based on this, but it's first and foremost a matter of social connection.

  • What Peterson didn't mention in terms of what are these people (IQ<83) going to do is "send them to prison". Have a look at incarceration rates in the USA.
    Of course this was pointed out by Herrnstein and Murray in The Bell Curve, but the debate was derailed by that one chapter speculating about race and IQ.
    The majority of low IQ people in the US are white so this is not specifically a racial problem.

  • AI taking all jobs is scary. Companies will be nothing but executives and robots. Of course the execs will be replaced too eventually.

  • Waow! To put so much into an "IQ test" is so stupid! HAHAHA, so that value high IQ are retards! HAHAHA! On top of that studies have shown that your intelligence has little to do with where you are in n life! Suprisingley from what EVERYONE thinks!
    As if "high IQ" = all over intelligence!

  • I rarely agree with Peterson so much but what he says is true. If people can get a job that earns then a LIVABLE income and from that job; self and societal respect, they are far less likely to start taking some kind of drug to find escape. If people are happy they need no escape.

    But not everyone will get addicted to opiates as not everyone gets addicted to alcohol-a drug.
    The U.S. distribution of wealth is ripping this country apart. The top 1% own 45% of this country's wealth.
    Teddy Roosevelt was a REPUBLICAN and broke up the steel, oil, bank and railroad monopolies.
    I cannot imagine any politician arguing for antitrust action against GOOGLE/AMAZON/FB etc. And yet just those 3 companies control a substantial amount of access to and content on the internet.

  • IQ is pretty much just a militaristic version of intelligence…its not meant to be friendly to us so…doesnt that say something about society…

  • I agree to what he says about low IQ people to a certain extent. If they can't fill a traditional job role then they could pick up trash on the side of the freeway or any other job that a 5 year old could perform to earn the welfare benefits that they are most likely receiving.

  • Utter horseshit…. IQ tests are culturally skewed and have nothing to do with creativity…. this guy is a ridiculous fraud

  • If your IQ is over 135ish, you're just as bad off as if you had an IQ under 85. At some point, you get so intelligent, (that unless you're highly focused AND provided ample means to achieve self actualization,) you're so "different" that you don't "fit in" anymore, and nobody wants you. You don't understand everybody else, and nobody understands you. It's a crushing situation honestly. A lot of smart people end up in prison or victims of suicide because of this very reason, and not many people think about that.

  • So in your brutal knowledge, the people of Cambodia (video 18:00) must have an IQ between 1 and 12, seen the video:
    https://youtu.be/-fusUxEPwsw

  • 54 seconds in. Already making assumptions there’s a “programmer” and has already talked about God.
    Presents things as “illegal” but offers no proof.
    Talks about intelligences but gives no citation or definition.
    Makes claims standardized testing are intelligence tests and not aptitude tests with no clear difference between.

    No definitions, no clear logic structure.
    No wonder this is shared for free.

    Academia strives for making the complex into clarity.
    53 seconds in and already he isn’t clear. If I tested you in this, I could grade you any way I wanted. I could say you misunderstood everything and fail you.

  • The thing that makes me laugh when it comes to IQ or education…. is no matter what your IQ is, you have an equal vote in a democracy. So it doesn't matter whether you have an IQ of 75 or an IQ of 140 or an IQ of 190, your votes all count equally. And same goes for your fancy educations. A person with a doctorate from MIT has the same voting power as a guy who scrubs toilets. lol. It's actually kind of funny when you think about it. And there's no way to solve that problem without pissing people off.

    The stupid people vastly outnumber the intelligent ones, and so who really runs the world? Well, a president with an IQ, if I'm being generous, of around 80 is running America right now. He speaks the language of "stupid", a language that all idiots understand. So yeah…. who rules the world? Stupid people. And that's even funnier, because for all the intelligence you members of MENSA have, you couldn't find a way to rule the world. The idiots are firmly in control, and it's only going to go downhill from here.

  • I'm not sure how stupid someone is sub 85 IQ however I'm sceptical there's nothing they could do for work. Is the alternative allow them to live without working through welfare, I'm not convinced by that as people need to be occupied and a degree of structure. It is crucial we understand the population so we can prevent as many people as possible falling off the edge of sociaty.

  • The conservatives also suggested that those 15% of lowest IQ should try a bit more. To be honest, I don't see much difference between 70 IQ and 90 IQ.
    Repetitive jobs can't be that difficult?

  • This whole thing is a trap. life is for living. nobody should be fighting to work for the corporation. This is an arms race that businesses have gotten into. It is in the end counter productive because if more people are without jobs, the economy cannot be sustained. It is not just about age of disruption but more so that it destroys the economic foundation. The whole system has been built wrong. It is all about greed and that is going to lead to an unfortunate ending for man kind.

  • You can operate machines with a below average IQ, but you cannot be a true “machinists”. A true machinist uses rather complex mathematics.
    The lowest IQ in college students are majoring in education. That’s not a joke, look it up.

  • If you're looking for who the DUMBEST (and/or lowest IQ) people at college are, try "education majors". Journalism/"communication" majors are a close second. While I'm sure our modern, "woke" curriculums have offerings which can accommodate even dumber people, education majors have, historically, been the basement dwellers. Gender studies probably has them beat by now because, let's face it, if you can't figure out the difference between, well, let's call 'em "innies" and "outies", then you're pretty friggin' stupid.

  • There are many other dimensions of employability apart from IQ. What automation is doing is to make human more humane. The transition will be ugly, but future generations might have a different definition of jobs and employability.

  • Also, AI automation = death of DEMOCRACY. When the tax revenue does not come from a productive workforce; democracy always fails.

  • 5:30 Well. McDonald's has implemented robots or machines for taking orders. That was a bad argument, though this does not dispute his view or fact that people with a low IQ struggle to find work.

  • So what exactly are people like us supposed to do then, Just die off? If we can't earn a living and can't live off the government what the fuck are we supposed to do? And with automation coming there will definitely not be any jobs for people like us soon enough.

  • I am a 28 year old jobless adult with an Iq tested at age 13 to be of 138. I promise you I feel as close to mentally challenged as can be everyday.

  • No matter how well articulated the argument, never let anybody tell you you’re not smart enough to do something. Maybe you’re not, but if you don’t try in the first place, then… 🤷‍♂️

  • Personally, I feel statistics like this do have a basis but to take them as fact is to take any hypothesis as fact. Idk how many studies have been done to measure the complete accuracy of this correlation, and people regarded to be the most influential of all time will tell you success it’s more about ethics than numbers. Charles Darwin was said to have an IQ in the 160s, but if you do research you’ll find he tested in the 130s, there have been noble prize winners with IQ below genius level and brilliant writers with a average IQ. You’ll see people who were born before the IQ was even created given insane scores almost as if we’re impose our biases about society onto them. We’re digging ourselves into a ditch by taking our ideas so seriously that we cease to understand what an “idea” is.

  • people who are obsessed with their or other peoples' iq often have simultaneous inferiority and superiority complexes, a symptom of narcissism. "if this is too hard for you, you are making people around you at work miserable (peterson)," which is pretty much saying "you might want to give up on things that are difficult for you." I dont think dr. peterson would endorse "giving up" because he would be contradicting himself against his kind of positive "can-do-pull your self up by your boot straps" spirit of that he so often tries to get across.

     my point is that if you're in a job or position or study and you're finding it very hard, there may be a variety reasons unrelated to iq. I don't think you need to have a high iq to become a phd in physics, a doctor, etc; plus, iq tends to increase with education. it takes a lot of things, things you could find on any motivational poster to plug through the work needed to get there.

    peterson seems to take a mixed conservative position, so take his lectures not as concrete, i suppose, but as postulations that are open to debate. as a side, some conservatives who take these ignorant positions become more ignorant when you argue them. i personally think he's a frustrated conservative guy who wants everything to go well and wants an expedient way to get there even if it is ignorant.

    ive had some menial-ish jobs and had met plenty of people in those jobs – with the same job and title – who went to the very top schools with some of them possessing "superior intelligence" as measured by an iq test. ive met people with high iqs who didnt go to the best schools and chose not to become what we consider jobs only those with iqs go into but pretty much menial jobs.

    i worked with a guy who worked his way up into a scientific job in the navy. he could go on and on about the finer points of nuclear reactors and he later told me his iq was like 85 or something.

    i guess what guys like peterson look at are people at the top of the biggest companies and make the assumption that they have high iqs. it's quite possible that they may test with higher than average iqs, but again iq can increase with education. also, many or most if not nearly all people in the highest positions at companies or higher paying positions started out in life with an advantages in education and living situations. i cant remember the name of that famous physicist, but i read that his iq score in his 20s was 124, ok, which is by all metrics not genius level; though, he must have obtained a genius level measured iq during the course of working on harder and harder problems in his life career given what he accomplished. that or, again, very high iq isn't necessary.

    my personal observations inform me that 1. the better in life you start out at, the better you will be later in life financially; 2. yes, there are some people who happened to win a genetic lottery in terms of having higher intelligence; 3. however, with enough work and dedication, pretty much anyone could become good at anything – you just have to put in the time and work.

  • Before I entered the US Army I underwent the ASVAB, the GT score is the equivalent to IQ as far as I understand it. My GT score was 139 and my brother's GT score was 127 (I think). There were only two other soldiers in my battalion whose GT scores excelled my own (145 and 149, I think). One was a self taught man who had the equivalent of a seven year university education. The other was a computer programmer with extraordinary abilities who disappeared one day under some pretty weird circumstances (that usually means special duty/operations.)
    I chose the Infantry not only because I'm crazy and so is my brother but because what else are ya gonna choose when you go to serve your Country? Shuffle paperwork? Turn a wrench?
    Nah, shoot the enemy. Make him bleed for his ideology. Yea, baby!
    What is my point? I now work driving an oil truck. I make good money but I am infinitely bored. My father was an electrical engineer designing supercomputers and secret squirrel stuff all through the 70s, 80s and part of the 90s. But as a parent he sucked. He didn't know how to inspire, teach or motivate. He degraded and distrusted everyone, especially his own children and wife.
    FATHERS MATTER BEYOND WORDS!
    Anyone who has succeeded to levels of excellence has most likely had a father who at least cared enough to teach the basics. I don't blame him for my life. My life is and will always be mine to live. But I hate father's day with a passion without description.
    On this Thanksgiving Day I suggest that if you have a good father you give him a giant hug and say "thanks for giving a crap about my success in life, dad".
    Who knows where I would be now if my father had taken a vested interest in my success, instead of feeling paranoid and threatened by my intelligence.
    So, yeah that's my two cents. Maybe IQ scores are BS, maybe not. But there is a lot more to success than IQ, otherwise I'd probably be a doctor or chemist or physicist or engineer or . . .

  • Jordan Peterson, You are wrong in this one, stupid people sometimes have more success, cower has more success with thief manager, some time manager need stupid people around him to stay in control, this is the real-life

  • Universal basic income is the most straightforward solution to the probelm. And the money will mean more as tech progresses.

  • Andrew Yang has been talking about this for some years. The DNC is blacking out his campaign or making him look like a goofy guy who just wants to give out free money.

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